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	<title>Comments on: A Recommendation for the Dehomogenization Debate</title>
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	<link>http://archive.mises.org/3700/a-recommendation-for-the-dehomogenization-debate/</link>
	<description>Proceeding Ever More Boldly Against Evil</description>
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		<title>By: Paul Edwards</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/3700/a-recommendation-for-the-dehomogenization-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-18903</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Edwards</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jun 2005 14:43:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/archives/003700.asp#comment-18903</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Robert: From &quot;Economic Calculation in the Socialist Commonwealth&quot;, &quot;Postscript: Why a Socialist Economy is &quot;Impossible&quot; by Joseph T. Salerno&quot;
http://mises.org/econcalc/POST.asp
it seems you and Salerno are not so far apart. 

For instance he uses the phrase &quot;Knowledge of past market prices&quot;, which should confirm that knowledge of past market prices is indeed knowledge. He also says &quot;Whether or not one prefers to characterize entrepreneurial forecasting and appraisement as a procedure for &quot;discovery&quot; of knowledge, as Hayek does, what is important is that for Mises it is the indispensable starting point of the competitive process and not its social culminant&quot;, which I think is what you are also driving at.

Does it seem that, according to Salerno, the knowledge of present prices is only necessary but not sufficient to obtain a non-chaotic market. The other key ingredient is the entrepreneur, who by owning the means of production is willing and able to use the knowledge of current prices to calculate; that critical market activity unavailable to the planner. It seems you all agree that regardless of how much even accurate knowledge a socialist planner could acquire and perhaps he could acquire a lot, without the entrepreneur, no necessary calculation can follow. 

The paragraph from which I am quoting is this:

&quot;For Mises, the starting point for entrepreneurial planning of production in a market economy is the experience of the present (actually immediately past) price structure of the market as well as of the underlying economic data. Knowledge of past market prices by the entrepreneur does not substitute for qualitative information about the economy, as Hayek seems to argue, but is necessarily complementary to it. The reason, for Mises, is that it is price structures as they emerge at future moments of time that are relevant to unavoidably time-consuming and therefore future-oriented production plans. But entrepreneurs can never know future prices directly; they are only able to appraise them in light of their &quot;experience&quot; of past prices and of their &quot;understanding&quot; of what transformations will take place in the present configuration of the qualitative economic data. Whether or not one prefers to characterize entrepreneurial forecasting and appraisement as a procedure for &quot;discovery&quot; of knowledge, as Hayek does, what is important is that for Mises it is the indispensable starting point of the competitive process and not its social culminant.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Robert: From &#8220;Economic Calculation in the Socialist Commonwealth&#8221;, &#8220;Postscript: Why a Socialist Economy is &#8220;Impossible&#8221; by Joseph T. Salerno&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://mises.org/econcalc/POST.asp" rel="nofollow">http://mises.org/econcalc/POST.asp</a><br />
it seems you and Salerno are not so far apart. </p>
<p>For instance he uses the phrase &#8220;Knowledge of past market prices&#8221;, which should confirm that knowledge of past market prices is indeed knowledge. He also says &#8220;Whether or not one prefers to characterize entrepreneurial forecasting and appraisement as a procedure for &#8220;discovery&#8221; of knowledge, as Hayek does, what is important is that for Mises it is the indispensable starting point of the competitive process and not its social culminant&#8221;, which I think is what you are also driving at.</p>
<p>Does it seem that, according to Salerno, the knowledge of present prices is only necessary but not sufficient to obtain a non-chaotic market. The other key ingredient is the entrepreneur, who by owning the means of production is willing and able to use the knowledge of current prices to calculate; that critical market activity unavailable to the planner. It seems you all agree that regardless of how much even accurate knowledge a socialist planner could acquire and perhaps he could acquire a lot, without the entrepreneur, no necessary calculation can follow. </p>
<p>The paragraph from which I am quoting is this:</p>
<p>&#8220;For Mises, the starting point for entrepreneurial planning of production in a market economy is the experience of the present (actually immediately past) price structure of the market as well as of the underlying economic data. Knowledge of past market prices by the entrepreneur does not substitute for qualitative information about the economy, as Hayek seems to argue, but is necessarily complementary to it. The reason, for Mises, is that it is price structures as they emerge at future moments of time that are relevant to unavoidably time-consuming and therefore future-oriented production plans. But entrepreneurs can never know future prices directly; they are only able to appraise them in light of their &#8220;experience&#8221; of past prices and of their &#8220;understanding&#8221; of what transformations will take place in the present configuration of the qualitative economic data. Whether or not one prefers to characterize entrepreneurial forecasting and appraisement as a procedure for &#8220;discovery&#8221; of knowledge, as Hayek does, what is important is that for Mises it is the indispensable starting point of the competitive process and not its social culminant.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Andy D.</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/3700/a-recommendation-for-the-dehomogenization-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-18863</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jun 2005 05:12:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/archives/003700.asp#comment-18863</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I thought the calculation problem with socialism was not that they couldn&#039;t gain the information from prices, but that prices would eventually become so skewed from governmet intervention, that it would be impossible to have economic calculation. So is Mises saying that prices do convey information, but not knowledge? ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought the calculation problem with socialism was not that they couldn&#8217;t gain the information from prices, but that prices would eventually become so skewed from governmet intervention, that it would be impossible to have economic calculation. So is Mises saying that prices do convey information, but not knowledge? </p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/3700/a-recommendation-for-the-dehomogenization-debate/comment-page-1/#comment-18859</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jun 2005 03:49:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/archives/003700.asp#comment-18859</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Market prices don&#039;t have to convey information, specific or otherwise, to entrepreneurs in order to act as a guide to entrepreneurs -- they simply have to exist. Prices don&#039;t transmit knowledge so much as they influence incentive structures. 

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Market prices don&#8217;t have to convey information, specific or otherwise, to entrepreneurs in order to act as a guide to entrepreneurs &#8212; they simply have to exist. Prices don&#8217;t transmit knowledge so much as they influence incentive structures. </p>
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