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	<title>Comments on: ACTA: The War on Progress, Freedom, and Human Civilization</title>
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	<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/</link>
	<description>Proceeding Ever More Boldly Against Evil</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 00:55:50 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Hershel Brodersen</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-736807</link>
		<dc:creator>Hershel Brodersen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Nov 2010 02:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-736807</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Why is it that released reminds me of another corresponding person that I read some place else?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is it that released reminds me of another corresponding person that I read some place else?</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-712535</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Aug 2010 23:43:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-712535</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[But this paper I have shared with MANY friends of mine, whom all agree things are getting out of hand in the copyright arena. Superb work, Mr. Stolyarov!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But this paper I have shared with MANY friends of mine, whom all agree things are getting out of hand in the copyright arena. Superb work, Mr. Stolyarov!</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-712532</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Aug 2010 23:40:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-712532</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The story is actually old enough to fall under what is (I believe) called public domain--the really free, old stuff. He would not, I imagine, have to purchase any kind of right to remake the story. And as far as your original statement about the parasitical organisations is concerned, they are parasitical in the sense they rely for their profits (after the original sales of their hard-made products) on the State-created copyright legislation now in place. This allows them to prohibit such actions as other people using their characters or parts of their creations in other works (think the Avatar&#039;s Navii battling Serenity&#039;s Reavers...), public performance/playing/showing legitimately-purchased media (a prohibition first outlawed in the original Fair-Use Doctrine, but subsequently overturned when the media companies became too whiny to Congress...), etc. 
   I&#039;m ALL FOR companies choosing to retain the exclusive right to duplicate their works, for instance, but after something is legitimately purchased it is morally repugnant for anyone to try and impose artificial restrictions on the use of the good, beyond those rights which were reserved. And truly the only one in my opinion that CAN morally be reserved is the right of future duplication. In that way, an artist has the ability to discriminate (somewhat) on the rate of dissemination, and therefore the future profits he may make on said work, but it would in no way affect others in taking the IDEAS introduced or adapted by his work and using them in new works! Everybody wins.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The story is actually old enough to fall under what is (I believe) called public domain&#8211;the really free, old stuff. He would not, I imagine, have to purchase any kind of right to remake the story. And as far as your original statement about the parasitical organisations is concerned, they are parasitical in the sense they rely for their profits (after the original sales of their hard-made products) on the State-created copyright legislation now in place. This allows them to prohibit such actions as other people using their characters or parts of their creations in other works (think the Avatar&#8217;s Navii battling Serenity&#8217;s Reavers&#8230;), public performance/playing/showing legitimately-purchased media (a prohibition first outlawed in the original Fair-Use Doctrine, but subsequently overturned when the media companies became too whiny to Congress&#8230;), etc.<br />
   I&#8217;m ALL FOR companies choosing to retain the exclusive right to duplicate their works, for instance, but after something is legitimately purchased it is morally repugnant for anyone to try and impose artificial restrictions on the use of the good, beyond those rights which were reserved. And truly the only one in my opinion that CAN morally be reserved is the right of future duplication. In that way, an artist has the ability to discriminate (somewhat) on the rate of dissemination, and therefore the future profits he may make on said work, but it would in no way affect others in taking the IDEAS introduced or adapted by his work and using them in new works! Everybody wins.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-712530</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Aug 2010 23:23:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-712530</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Unless of course, as Rothbard pointed out as possible in his &quot;bundle of rights&quot; theory, the specific right to duplicate was NOT included in the sale...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unless of course, as Rothbard pointed out as possible in his &#8220;bundle of rights&#8221; theory, the specific right to duplicate was NOT included in the sale&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: El Tonno</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-708809</link>
		<dc:creator>El Tonno</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 20:28:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-708809</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;the Internet itself was created by people who became fabulously wealthy, often from winning lawsuits against those who violated their patented and/or copyrighted innovations&quot;

OH YEAH? [Citation needed]

Actually, you are totally wrong. The Internet itself was created by people who didn&#039;t care about patenting and often didn&#039;t care about copyright (look up what an &quot;RFC&quot; is). That&#039;s why you can actually hook up machines today without large fuss. Whenever patents appeared, niches got carved, someone sat in them, then died off like a cretin because people actually found out that using free protocols actually routed around this kind of proprietary B.S.

Kinda like IBM&#039;s oversight to lock down their ISA PC architecture. Next step: everyone copies it - huge success. The dumbasses then retried this with the locked-down PS/2. It died a long, cancerous illness as no-one could be bothered.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;the Internet itself was created by people who became fabulously wealthy, often from winning lawsuits against those who violated their patented and/or copyrighted innovations&#8221;</p>
<p>OH YEAH? [Citation needed]</p>
<p>Actually, you are totally wrong. The Internet itself was created by people who didn&#8217;t care about patenting and often didn&#8217;t care about copyright (look up what an &#8220;RFC&#8221; is). That&#8217;s why you can actually hook up machines today without large fuss. Whenever patents appeared, niches got carved, someone sat in them, then died off like a cretin because people actually found out that using free protocols actually routed around this kind of proprietary B.S.</p>
<p>Kinda like IBM&#8217;s oversight to lock down their ISA PC architecture. Next step: everyone copies it &#8211; huge success. The dumbasses then retried this with the locked-down PS/2. It died a long, cancerous illness as no-one could be bothered.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-708719</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 17:11:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-708719</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Rick, I strongly suggest that you go back and actually read what my post says, my point was only about the specific statement quoted, not the legislation itself or the rest of the article. Secondly, at no point did I say that only large organizations and companies were responsible for all creations or inventions, the term inventors implies individuals, but I guess your emotions got the better of you and you missed that. Lastly, I am quite certain that before Mr. Burton started filming he or his studio purchased the rights to, or paid for permission to remake the story.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick, I strongly suggest that you go back and actually read what my post says, my point was only about the specific statement quoted, not the legislation itself or the rest of the article. Secondly, at no point did I say that only large organizations and companies were responsible for all creations or inventions, the term inventors implies individuals, but I guess your emotions got the better of you and you missed that. Lastly, I am quite certain that before Mr. Burton started filming he or his studio purchased the rights to, or paid for permission to remake the story.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Waite</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707932</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Waite</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Aug 2010 05:02:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707932</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@DayOwl Agreed! Look at these new electronic cigarettes -- that is, smokeless cigarettes! Can&#039;t &quot;smoke&quot; indoors? We&#039;ll make smokeless cigarettes! I love markets.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@DayOwl Agreed! Look at these new electronic cigarettes &#8212; that is, smokeless cigarettes! Can&#8217;t &#8220;smoke&#8221; indoors? We&#8217;ll make smokeless cigarettes! I love markets.</p>
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		<title>By: Autolykos</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707888</link>
		<dc:creator>Autolykos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Aug 2010 02:32:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707888</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m glad I wasn&#039;t the only one who thought of that ancient abomination!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m glad I wasn&#8217;t the only one who thought of that ancient abomination!</p>
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		<title>By: DayOwl</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707786</link>
		<dc:creator>DayOwl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 20:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707786</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The glaring failure of both Prohibition and the War on Drugs give us reason to hope. Both prove that illegality does not dampen demand very much. If criminalization alone were enough to eliminate behaviors, we would not have the world&#039;s oldest profession either. 

Every time governments impose restrictions, people find a way around them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The glaring failure of both Prohibition and the War on Drugs give us reason to hope. Both prove that illegality does not dampen demand very much. If criminalization alone were enough to eliminate behaviors, we would not have the world&#8217;s oldest profession either. </p>
<p>Every time governments impose restrictions, people find a way around them.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Albin</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707734</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Albin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 18:43:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707734</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One of the ways I think about this is in terms of property ownership.  If two people negotiate on the sale of an item one of them created, and reach an agreed upon price for the exchange, then the creator gives the created item to the purchaser for a set amount of money (or property, etc) - at this point, the new owner should be able to do whatever they want with their new property.  If it is a new hit song, then the owner should be able to copy and distribute it for an agreed upon price (or for free).  If the creator wants earn something on his creation, then he should price it accordingly when he sells it (or distribute it himself, or keep it to himself).  Once something is sold in the marketplace, the new owner needs to be just that - the owner!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the ways I think about this is in terms of property ownership.  If two people negotiate on the sale of an item one of them created, and reach an agreed upon price for the exchange, then the creator gives the created item to the purchaser for a set amount of money (or property, etc) &#8211; at this point, the new owner should be able to do whatever they want with their new property.  If it is a new hit song, then the owner should be able to copy and distribute it for an agreed upon price (or for free).  If the creator wants earn something on his creation, then he should price it accordingly when he sells it (or distribute it himself, or keep it to himself).  Once something is sold in the marketplace, the new owner needs to be just that &#8211; the owner!</p>
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		<title>By: Eugene</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707721</link>
		<dc:creator>Eugene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 18:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707721</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Based on your argument, if ACTA passes then you could somehow be prosecuted for having quoted Ms. Rand; I guess that&#039;s one of your points.

If I may play the proverbial devil&#039;s advocate, the Internet itself was created by people who became fabulously wealthy, often from winning lawsuits against those who violated their patented and/or copyrighted innovations. You cannot escape the reality that some of the greatest works of all time, like Star Wars by George Lucas, were fraught with the very battles against copyright infringers that in YOUR &quot;ideal world&quot; would not have been protected.

Many innovations during the recent century were based on those who fully expected to get fabulously wealthy. Does that lessen the value of these innovations? Under the communist revolution in &quot;Mother Russia&quot; from where my mother escaped during the war, such &quot;greed&quot; was considered as moral turpitude, because in an ideal world, such selfish interests were believed to taint innovations. Of course, while the communist party extolled such &quot;virtues&quot; they quietly kept their greatest scientists in the equivalent of today&#039;s gated communities, as their neighbors, living a Bolsheviks’ lifestyle that motivated many intellectuals to achieve such greatness.

I wish to make it clear that I believe that in respect to freedom, there must be yin and yang. If regulators fail to succeed in silencing the Mises Institute&#039;s radical worldviews, then as the song goes, &quot;it&#039;s the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.&quot;

As an aside, with the disturbing changes in government you pointed out, don&#039;t be surprised if one day the FBI and other Federal agencies raid the Mises Institute&#039;s offices and place its people under arrest for &quot;sedition&quot; or even &quot;treason.&quot; Are you prepared to suffer martyrdom in the name of Mises? Hopefully, it will never come to that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Based on your argument, if ACTA passes then you could somehow be prosecuted for having quoted Ms. Rand; I guess that&#8217;s one of your points.</p>
<p>If I may play the proverbial devil&#8217;s advocate, the Internet itself was created by people who became fabulously wealthy, often from winning lawsuits against those who violated their patented and/or copyrighted innovations. You cannot escape the reality that some of the greatest works of all time, like Star Wars by George Lucas, were fraught with the very battles against copyright infringers that in YOUR &#8220;ideal world&#8221; would not have been protected.</p>
<p>Many innovations during the recent century were based on those who fully expected to get fabulously wealthy. Does that lessen the value of these innovations? Under the communist revolution in &#8220;Mother Russia&#8221; from where my mother escaped during the war, such &#8220;greed&#8221; was considered as moral turpitude, because in an ideal world, such selfish interests were believed to taint innovations. Of course, while the communist party extolled such &#8220;virtues&#8221; they quietly kept their greatest scientists in the equivalent of today&#8217;s gated communities, as their neighbors, living a Bolsheviks’ lifestyle that motivated many intellectuals to achieve such greatness.</p>
<p>I wish to make it clear that I believe that in respect to freedom, there must be yin and yang. If regulators fail to succeed in silencing the Mises Institute&#8217;s radical worldviews, then as the song goes, &#8220;it&#8217;s the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.&#8221;</p>
<p>As an aside, with the disturbing changes in government you pointed out, don&#8217;t be surprised if one day the FBI and other Federal agencies raid the Mises Institute&#8217;s offices and place its people under arrest for &#8220;sedition&#8221; or even &#8220;treason.&#8221; Are you prepared to suffer martyrdom in the name of Mises? Hopefully, it will never come to that.</p>
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		<title>By: Rick</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707711</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 18:00:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707711</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tim,

His point there is that ACTA &quot;negotiations&quot; are happening mostly in secret and without representative government or civilian input. Freedom of information requests have been turned down because of bogus &quot;national security&quot; reasons but the likes of RIAA and the MPAA have been let in the door. It&#039;s protectionist corporatism as its worst. For something that can have such far reaching impact on peoples lives, the very least they can do is be far more transparent and debate this openly in Congress... dubious that it really has to be discussed at all. 

But if ACTA is so moral in your opinion, please tell us why the negotiations are happening in secret? 

As for &quot;actual creation&quot;, surely not all creation is done by large organizations and companies. I think you probably know that but your emotion has got the best of you and you&#039;re defending something you have relatively little or no stake in, unless you do, but that would put you in the rent seeker category. 

And based on your logic,&lt;i&gt;&quot;simply taking another person&#039;s creation and putting your name on it does not make you an actual creator&quot;&lt;/i&gt;, do you mean that Tim Burton&#039;s recent &lt;i&gt;Alice in Wonderland&lt;/i&gt; movie or any adaptation of that story since the original isn&#039;t &quot;actually creative&quot;?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim,</p>
<p>His point there is that ACTA &#8220;negotiations&#8221; are happening mostly in secret and without representative government or civilian input. Freedom of information requests have been turned down because of bogus &#8220;national security&#8221; reasons but the likes of RIAA and the MPAA have been let in the door. It&#8217;s protectionist corporatism as its worst. For something that can have such far reaching impact on peoples lives, the very least they can do is be far more transparent and debate this openly in Congress&#8230; dubious that it really has to be discussed at all. </p>
<p>But if ACTA is so moral in your opinion, please tell us why the negotiations are happening in secret? </p>
<p>As for &#8220;actual creation&#8221;, surely not all creation is done by large organizations and companies. I think you probably know that but your emotion has got the best of you and you&#8217;re defending something you have relatively little or no stake in, unless you do, but that would put you in the rent seeker category. </p>
<p>And based on your logic,<i>&#8220;simply taking another person&#8217;s creation and putting your name on it does not make you an actual creator&#8221;</i>, do you mean that Tim Burton&#8217;s recent <i>Alice in Wonderland</i> movie or any adaptation of that story since the original isn&#8217;t &#8220;actually creative&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: Rex Bibendi</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707696</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Bibendi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 17:28:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707696</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[“Meanwhile, front seats at the negotiating table were offered to the parasitic organizations which have thwarted actual creators’ freedoms…”

The parasitic organizations here are the companies that stand in line waiting for a bailout.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“Meanwhile, front seats at the negotiating table were offered to the parasitic organizations which have thwarted actual creators’ freedoms…”</p>
<p>The parasitic organizations here are the companies that stand in line waiting for a bailout.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Curtis</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707649</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Curtis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 15:52:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707649</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mr.StolyarovII states that &quot;Meanwhile, front seats at the negotiating table were offered to the parasitic organizations which have thwarted actual creators&#039; freedoms...&quot; By parasitic organizations do you mean the companies and inventors of the copyrighted products and material? Those who have spent years of their lives and millions of their dollars to invent and create what you and others now  -without having contributed anything to the process- want parasitically to profit on or from. Simply taking another person&#039;s creation and putting your name on it does not make you an &quot;actual creator&quot;, it makes you a moocher or whatever else you wish to call yourself.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr.StolyarovII states that &#8220;Meanwhile, front seats at the negotiating table were offered to the parasitic organizations which have thwarted actual creators&#8217; freedoms&#8230;&#8221; By parasitic organizations do you mean the companies and inventors of the copyrighted products and material? Those who have spent years of their lives and millions of their dollars to invent and create what you and others now  -without having contributed anything to the process- want parasitically to profit on or from. Simply taking another person&#8217;s creation and putting your name on it does not make you an &#8220;actual creator&#8221;, it makes you a moocher or whatever else you wish to call yourself.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Albin</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707647</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Albin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 15:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707647</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That was great and informative.  The only part that I frowned at was when you said that movie studios make garbage films to appeal to the lowest something or other.  The reason why these movies are made is because teens and college kids have a relatively high percentage of disposable income, and prefer these silly, sex-filled, and/or violent films.  I think it&#039;s a stretch to say that they are doing anything other than serving their core customers.  As you rightly point out, the internet allows all sort of wonderful and varied content to be displayed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was great and informative.  The only part that I frowned at was when you said that movie studios make garbage films to appeal to the lowest something or other.  The reason why these movies are made is because teens and college kids have a relatively high percentage of disposable income, and prefer these silly, sex-filled, and/or violent films.  I think it&#8217;s a stretch to say that they are doing anything other than serving their core customers.  As you rightly point out, the internet allows all sort of wonderful and varied content to be displayed.</p>
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		<title>By: Ohhh Henry</title>
		<link>http://archive.mises.org/13458/acta-the-war-on-progress-freedom-and-human-civilization/comment-page-1/#comment-707642</link>
		<dc:creator>Ohhh Henry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 15:42:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.mises.org/?p=13458#comment-707642</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ACTA will have about the same long-term effect on the world as the Edict of Diocletian.  But civilization may be damaged and a lot of people&#039;s lives may be destroyed in the meantime.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ACTA will have about the same long-term effect on the world as the Edict of Diocletian.  But civilization may be damaged and a lot of people&#8217;s lives may be destroyed in the meantime.</p>
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